Author Topic: ESA and ESA Calibration  (Read 22214 times)

ilpo

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ESA and ESA Calibration
« on: May 28, 2013, 05:45:55 PM »
I have had issues with my ESA, now that I took a look at first I saw this:


After I applied the ESA adjustment for both rear and back it went into this:



What do these now tell? What was actually wrong with this? Both were taken when bike was on center stand, bike was not moved between these.

I need to go to test drive now...
« Last Edit: May 29, 2013, 12:25:06 PM by StephanT »

StephanT

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Re: Re: GS-911 Beta V1305.3
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2013, 11:43:36 AM »
I have had issues with my ESA, now that I took a look at first I saw this:


What do these now tell? What was actually wrong with this? Both were taken when bike was on center stand, bike was not moved between these.
Quite simple... for front and rear respectively it tells you what the maximum number of pulses is... i.e. from the one end to the other end.. there are 1130 pulses for the rear shock, and it also tells you what the current value is, of where it is right now... i.e.  33 for both your front and rear shock after calibration...

you will see these current settings change for different ESA modes... (obviously as the preload is in a different position)

...now what does this tell you.. well, it tells you that it is at position 33 of 1130 (these are the HALL sensor pulses that are measured... or of you like, at 3% of the travel of the preload...

now looking at our R1200GS Adventure.... after a calibration, I see the following:

Now looking at the rear shock, I can see that I am at position 61 and have a full scale of 2002, or in other words my rear preload is set at 3% of the travel of the preload... and my ESA is set on Comfort for a single rider (one helmet)... The Comfort/Nomal/Sport etc. are irrelevant here, cause they are rebound/damping related... what we are seeing here (the numbers) are for the preload, hence the single rider (1 helmet)...

what else do we learn from this...
that your ESA setting was probably set to single rider as well (hence the same 3 %)
and very importantly, THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT VARIATIONS OF SUSPENSION used by BMW... see that our one has a max travel of around 2000 pulses, while your one had a max of just over 1100 pulses...

And this is one of the reasons why one needs to calibrate the ESA.. if we would remove the rear shock from OUR bike, and replace it with your shock, then on the singel rider (1 helmet), the ESA would set the suspension to approximately position 61 pulses... (without knowing that the max travel is only 1100 pulses... and effectively the preload would be set far too high... (6% where it should be 3%)

hope this makes some sense...  ;D

StephanT

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2013, 12:33:14 PM »
Now, for a minute... let's just assume we could set the 1 Helmet, 2 Helmet, and 2 Helmet with Luggage target values...

that means you could set up the bike according to YOUR individual needs... ...i.e. I'm not sure how many of you are 80kg riders, with full Kit... definitely not me.. But (thankfully), I'm not 160kg either... Thus my single rider should be somewhere in between 1 Helmet and 2 Helmet...

...Just saying... would be nice... wouldn't it !

best,
Stephan

ilpo

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2013, 12:46:35 PM »
Now, for a minute... let's just assume we could set the 1 Helmet, 2 Helmet, and 2 Helmet with Luggage target values...

that means you could set up the bike according to YOUR individual needs... ...i.e. I'm not sure how many of you are 80kg riders, with full Kit... definitely not me.. But (thankfully), I'm not 160kg either... Thus my single rider should be somewhere in between 1 Helmet and 2 Helmet...

...Just saying... would be nice... wouldn't it !

best,
Stephan

Yes - when can we do that  ;)

But still, I'm thinking about the first measurement on the rear 563/1126, that can't be right? I had 1 helmet selected, front was just fine but rear was way over the setting. But after this calibration is was set correctly and it also felt that something was happening when switching between different settings, bike was moving higher/lower.

StephanT

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2013, 01:50:12 PM »
well, you said you had an issue with your ESA... tell us a bit more... what were the symptoms etc.. ?

now that GS-911 can show these values, we can see how many other people have this or similar issues...  There are some related ESA Fault codes, that tell you there is an issue with the ESA and that it requires calibration... However, I can't tell you what the test requirements are from the ECU, to make it realize that it has an issue and requires calibration... (that's internal to the ZFE)

best,
Stephan

ilpo

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2013, 01:54:24 PM »
There were no errors logged in the system, just these values.

What I mean that it does not work is that it feels really horrible to drive, not as stable as it used to be. Now I have already ordered pair of new Öhlins, so interesting to see what values does that give through GS-911...

Yesterday I had also another R1200GSA and I took a look these values in there and they were pretty much the same as I had after the calibration. Similar situation, 1 helmet and bike on center stand.

StephanT

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2013, 02:26:41 PM »
ok, some more feedback - just for the curious... some measurements on our '11 R1200GS Adv.

Max setting:front (1073)rear (2002)
1 helmet: 33 (3%) 62 (3%)
1 helmet + luggage: 33 (3%) 1003 (50%)
2 helmets: 33 (3%) 1942 (97%)
small mountain: 536 (50%) 1000 (50%)
large mountain: 1040 (97%) 1942 (97%)

So, you can see that first three impact only on the rear suspension (with the front being at basically zero preload), while the last two, adjust the front one to Half and Full preload, respectively...

As I said... just for interest sake....  :o
« Last Edit: May 29, 2013, 02:33:21 PM by kobus »

juhhyto

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2013, 08:57:27 PM »
THIS info should have been on the user manual from the factory. Now we can start to see more better the bike internals. And yes, personal preferences are welcome settings through GS-911.


-juha-

StephanT

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2013, 09:39:02 PM »
And yes, personal preferences are welcome settings through GS-911.
Unfortunately I'm not sure this is possible through the standard diagnostic methods to the ZFE... but will investigate...

ilpo

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #9 on: July 09, 2013, 06:42:38 PM »
Just a FYI AutoScan from GSA with stock ESA removed and replaced with Öhlins Mechatronics.

v-man

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Re: Re: GS-911 Beta V1305.3
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2013, 09:33:10 PM »
I have had issues with my ESA, now that I took a look at first I saw this:


Quite simple... for front and rear respectively it tells you what the maximum number of pulses is... i.e. from the one end to the other end.. there are 1130 pulses for the rear shock, and it also tells you what the current value is, of where it is right now... i.e.  33 for both your front and rear shock after calibration...

you will see these current settings change for different ESA modes... (obviously as the preload is in a different position)

...now what does this tell you.. well, it tells you that it is at position 33 of 1130 (these are the HALL sensor pulses that are measured... or of you like, at 3% of the travel of the preload...

now looking at our R1200GS Adventure.... after a calibration, I see the following:

Now looking at the rear shock, I can see that I am at position 61 and have a full scale of 2002, or in other words my rear preload is set at 3% of the travel of the preload... and my ESA is set on Comfort for a single rider (one helmet)... The Comfort/Nomal/Sport etc. are irrelevant here, cause they are rebound/damping related... what we are seeing here (the numbers) are for the preload, hence the single rider (1 helmet)...

what else do we learn from this...
that your ESA setting was probably set to single rider as well (hence the same 3 %)
and very importantly, THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT VARIATIONS OF SUSPENSION used by BMW... see that our one has a max travel of around 2000 pulses, while your one had a max of just over 1100 pulses...

And this is one of the reasons why one needs to calibrate the ESA.. if we would remove the rear shock from OUR bike, and replace it with your shock, then on the singel rider (1 helmet), the ESA would set the suspension to approximately position 61 pulses... (without knowing that the max travel is only 1100 pulses... and effectively the preload would be set far too high... (6% where it should be 3%)

hope this makes some sense...  ;D

Hello Stephan -

I just ran the ESA calibration on my 2010 R1200GSA.  My numbers were the same as ilpo ... would I expect to see the same numbers as you posted since you have a GSA also? Maybe settings are different for my older (older then yours) bike? 

I thought I would try the calibration because I have been having some issues with suspension "releasing" when stopped. Since no codes were stored maybe it's a mechanical issue not electronic? 

Thanks for any insight,

Don

StephanT

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2013, 06:47:17 PM »
hi Don,

not sure what you mean by "suspension releasing"?

on the same models I would expect to see the same range of values... although our rear sometime s goes to 2009 etc.  but around 2000 is the range...

best,
Stephan

v-man

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2013, 08:17:23 PM »
hi Don,

not sure what you mean by "suspension releasing"?

on the same models I would expect to see the same range of values... although our rear sometime s goes to 2009 etc.  but around 2000 is the range...

best,
Stephan

Hello Stephan -

Thanks for your quick response.  I thought the values would also be same for same model. I have been complaining to BMW for sometime regarding my suspension.  Unfortunate for me my dealer is not much help ... if they can't "duplicate" the exact problem they won't do anything! 

The "releasing" I was trying to describe is (doesn't happen all the time/everytime) - Sometimes when I stop the bike either parking or stopped for traffic the suspension feels like it's "releasing" and it raises the bike probably a good .75".  It has caught me by surprise before where I almost dropped the bike when it would raise VERY quickly.  It tends to happen when I have bike with full load or two up with partial loaded bags.  Bike is storing NO CODES acording to BMW and also GS911.  When the ESA calibration came out with your unit I thought maybe that would be the key ... I have done the calibration twice and still have same problem BUT our numbers do not match so I'm not sure what that means either??  I am at wits end and was considering replace with aftermarket shock but if it is in controls then problem will still exist except my wallet will be lighter!!!!

Don

StephanT

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Re: ESA and ESA Calibration
« Reply #13 on: July 30, 2013, 08:29:35 PM »
hi Don

I have it on good authority that there are MANY different ESA combinations, over the years, and manufacturer swops and motor and spring changes etc...

we can't really tell what the max values are for all the springs, as we have probably not seen all of them yet... but all you really care about it that you get the max, and then you will see the current values to be 3%, 50% and 97% for 1helmet, 1helmet+luggage, 2helmet settings respectively

the calibration is only there to determine the "max" number and then zero position.. from there the ZFE uses these values and reference to wind the preload to the required number of pulses for  3% 50% or 97% , depending on what setting you chose on your handlebar switch

best,
Stephan


best,
Stephan